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PRINCETON_JAKE

True Bogger
Registered: 04/05/11
Posts: 130
Reply with quote  #1 

ive read that some guys are going to run, or try to run 5 ton rockwells since planetaries are so heavy and expensive, and there are people like gearhart building upgrded parts for them. So has anyone been/started using 5 tons? how are they holding up compared to custom built planets

tntmonstertrucks

TGW Multi-Poster
Registered: 04/11/11
Posts: 70
Reply with quote  #2 

we built a turn ket race truck with 5tons  months ago   but we made up king pin braces for the upper and lower pins  and had to wrap the knuckles.  it hold up  but i wouldent be doin monster jam free style  with 5tons. and when your done its not a whole lot of weight difference  than 106s with clarks

gearharteng

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Registered: 11/08/11
Posts: 62
Reply with quote  #3 
5 tons in freestyle monster jam would work just as well as clarks with 106 combo, a lot cheaper. To get the planetarys to hold up it requires custom axle shafts, kingpin girdles,
billet spindles, and a lot are going to billet,or fabricated outer knuckle. I know because I am working some for a top team. And you still see wheels lock up, gears break,axles break.And price a set of 20 ton clarks if you can find them, would 5 ton axles work in stock form not even close but with the proper parts they would be just as durable with some performance advantages

PRINCETON_JAKE

True Bogger
Registered: 04/05/11
Posts: 130
Reply with quote  #4 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tntmonstertrucks

we built a turn ket race truck with 5tons  months ago   but we made up king pin braces for the upper and lower pins  and had to wrap the knuckles.  it hold up  but i wouldent be doin monster jam free style  with 5tons. and when your done its not a whole lot of weight difference  than 106s with clarks

 

I dont see why a custom axle like gearharts would be any less stronger then a planet axle, and in my eyes (and people i know) the problem with planets is they rob a TON of power, and in a mud truck getting enough wheelspeed can be a problem

Sofa King

JUSSA WANNABE BITCHES
Registered: 04/03/11
Posts: 968
Reply with quote  #5 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRINCETON_JAKE
Quote:
Originally Posted by tntmonstertrucks

we built a turn ket race truck with 5tons  months ago   but we made up king pin braces for the upper and lower pins  and had to wrap the knuckles.  it hold up  but i wouldent be doin monster jam free style  with 5tons. and when your done its not a whole lot of weight difference  than 106s with clarks


I dont see why a custom axle like gearharts would be any less stronger then a planet axle, and in my eyes (and people i know) the problem with planets is they rob a TON of power, and in a mud truck getting enough wheelspeed can be a problem


gearharts doesnt make the knuckles do they?? that seems to be the weak spot.. and i have yet to see a monster truck that had a problem with wheel speed.. just sayin..

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Why does everybody keep calling me Richard Noggin?? My name is George!!
iniviate

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LS1 S10 FTW
Registered: 03/24/11
Posts: 8,647
Reply with quote  #6 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRINCETON_JAKE
the problem with planets is they rob a TON of power



if the overall gearing is the same, what does it matter if the gear reduction is in the t-case or the hub?



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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcreynoldsair
if your going to change your screen name need to change how you wright

no punctuation and you spelled dozier wrong
collateral damage

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Registered: 04/03/11
Posts: 1,410
Reply with quote  #7 

Quote:
Originally Posted by iniviate
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRINCETON_JAKE
the problem with planets is they rob a TON of power



if the overall gearing is the same, what does it matter if the gear reduction is in the t-case or the hub?


i thought the same thing but i forgot who it was off chucks i was talking to but he said in planets you have drag in the t-case gears and center section of the axle gears and then the drag of the planet gears and with a 5 ton you just got the case and the center gears
it made sence but ..... 

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tonka tester

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Registered: 03/24/11
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Reply with quote  #8 
Quote:
Originally Posted by collateral damage

Quote:
Originally Posted by iniviate
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRINCETON_JAKE
the problem with planets is they rob a TON of power



if the overall gearing is the same, what does it matter if the gear reduction is in the t-case or the hub?


i thought the same thing but i forgot who it was off chucks i was talking to but he said in planets you have drag in the t-case gears and center section of the axle gears and then the drag of the planet gears and with a 5 ton you just got the case and the center gears
it made sence but ..... 
with planets, youd have a lot more gears spinning to make it go than with  a single case with a chosen gear ratio and 5 tons  
driveshaft speed would be different too

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http://i990.photobucket.com/albums/af30/tonkatester/Picture103.jpg looking for a tire like this (66x43x25)

THE MONSTER
http://www.tgwforums.com/post?id=5168515
the jeep
http://www.tgwforums.com/post/planetary-axled-flatfender-jeep-on-air-ride-with-a-turbo-new-pics-roller-now-6159179?pid=1276433439#post1276433439


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Sofa King

JUSSA WANNABE BITCHES
Registered: 04/03/11
Posts: 968
Reply with quote  #9 
So why did all the monster trucks switch to planets???
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Why does everybody keep calling me Richard Noggin?? My name is George!!
tonka tester

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Reply with quote  #10 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sofa King
So why did all the monster trucks switch to planets???
because they weighed 20,000 lbs back then... and they had 8" of suspension travel, and the 5 tons had no aftermarket support then.  

__________________
http://i990.photobucket.com/albums/af30/tonkatester/Picture103.jpg looking for a tire like this (66x43x25)

THE MONSTER
http://www.tgwforums.com/post?id=5168515
the jeep
http://www.tgwforums.com/post/planetary-axled-flatfender-jeep-on-air-ride-with-a-turbo-new-pics-roller-now-6159179?pid=1276433439#post1276433439


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██████USA████████
◥⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲◤
PRINCETON_JAKE

True Bogger
Registered: 04/05/11
Posts: 130
Reply with quote  #11 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sofa King
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRINCETON_JAKE
Quote:
Originally Posted by tntmonstertrucks

we built a turn ket race truck with 5tons  months ago   but we made up king pin braces for the upper and lower pins  and had to wrap the knuckles.  it hold up  but i wouldent be doin monster jam free style  with 5tons. and when your done its not a whole lot of weight difference  than 106s with clarks


I dont see why a custom axle like gearharts would be any less stronger then a planet axle, and in my eyes (and people i know) the problem with planets is they rob a TON of power, and in a mud truck getting enough wheelspeed can be a problem

 

 

http://www.tgwforums.com/post/some-more-5ton-beef-5175896?highlight=gearhart


gearharts doesnt make the knuckles do they?? that seems to be the weak spot.. and i have yet to see a monster truck that had a problem with wheel speed.. just sayin..
tntmonstertrucks

TGW Multi-Poster
Registered: 04/11/11
Posts: 70
Reply with quote  #12 

the thing is now  the parts are ready and avalible  for the clarks  and theres mostly  just talk about the aftermarket parts for the 5tons and no set pricing..   look at the stock size difference  of the king pins.plus the only way you can truly convince  90% of the mt guys to switch  is if  patrick   told guys they were the way to go lol 

mudevil

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Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 82
Reply with quote  #13 

Are we talking about 5 ton top loaders or a SQHD? I can't see monster trucks switching back to top loaders.

PRINCETON_JAKE

True Bogger
Registered: 04/05/11
Posts: 130
Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mudevil

Are we talking about 5 ton top loaders or a SQHD? I can't see monster trucks switching back to top loaders.

 

I agree Loren, would a built hybrid f106 center section hold up if it had 5 ton outers and axle shafts?

MUD SLUT

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HIGHLY CONTROVERSIAL
Registered: 03/24/11
Posts: 1,366
Reply with quote  #15 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRINCETON_JAKE
Quote:
Originally Posted by mudevil

Are we talking about 5 ton top loaders or a SQHD? I can't see monster trucks switching back to top loaders.

 

I agree Loren, would a built hybrid f106 center section hold up if it had 5 ton outers and axle shafts?



That doesn't really change anything. The weak points of the 5ton, in a monster jam setting, regardless of what's available in the aftermarket, lie in the knuckle and spindle. In that setup, you still have all the 5 tons weak points....

After I go get some grub, I'll come back and take y'all to school on axles and answer why the monster trucks switched, including iniviate's question.[biggrin]

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If my calculations are correct, when this baby hits 88 miles per hour... you're gonna see some serious shit.
AOP AIN'T GOT SHIT ON ME!
I'M THE JUGGERNAUT, BITCH!
Quote:
Originally Posted by iniviate
Who on 72"+ tires can do better than that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by z71on46s
I will monster truck your shit!
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamsnotsoperformance
oops read that backwards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by damnyankee
I've built everything on mine and you make me want to throw rocks at it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ON TIME
SHUT THE F#CK UP CORKY!
mudevil

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Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 82
Reply with quote  #16 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRINCETON_JAKE
Quote:
Originally Posted by mudevil

Are we talking about 5 ton top loaders or a SQHD? I can't see monster trucks switching back to top loaders.

 

I agree Loren, would a built hybrid f106 center section hold up if it had 5 ton outers and axle shafts?

 

Nope. The planets are the only thing keeping them alive.

adamsoffroadperformance

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Registered: 03/26/11
Posts: 614
Reply with quote  #17 

There is no stock axle of anykind that will hold up to MonsterJam freestyle in stock form. Look at any truck running today and they are all modifed pretty far from stock to take the abuse. The reason a planetary has more drag than say a tcase is because there is alot more surface area contact in a planetary than in a t case style setup. More surface area equals more friction and thats all there is to it. And the reason for most trucks switching to planets was as Tonka said. 30yrs ago a monster truck was 15k lbs or more had very little suspention travel which also was a stiff travel and had heavy wheels and heavy full cleat tires. Today's trucks can be built lighter and have 20+ inches of travel that is dampened by a hightech shock and the lightweight wheels and shaved tires of today also have relieved alot of the stress's that turned many guys away from 5tons. There are quite a few monstertruck guru's that are still running today that will tell ya that they got away from the 5ton before they should have. You all can speculate what would work what won't but when there are guys like Mike Vaters, John Seasock, Dave Rife, Everett Jasmer, Allen Pezo, Kid Rarig, Bob Shea, and many more I can keep naming, that all ran 5tons back in the day and are confident that a properly prepped 5ton will work and work very well at that gives a little more firm ground to stand on.


__________________
the planetary trucks break pinion shafts occasionally. the 5 ton trucks don't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevessuperduty
the true mud bogging in the good mud will always happen behind the scenes in the woods on private land.



http://www.adamsoffroadperformance.com

http://www.gearharteng.com
MUD SLUT

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Registered: 03/24/11
Posts: 1,366
Reply with quote  #18 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mudevil
Nope. The planets are the only thing keeping them alive.

Yes, I also forgot to mention you got rid of one of the 5ton's strong points, the chunk, and traded for a weaker one. And yes, f-106's have enough trouble staying together WITH the planets helping them out... Ring gear failures are quite common at events.

Quote:
Originally Posted by adamsoffroadperformance
The reason a planetary has more drag than say a tcase is because there is alot more surface area contact in a planetary than in a t case style setup. More surface area equals more friction and thats all there is to it.


Not quite and I'll put it to rest in a much longer, separate post here momentarily as I got too tied up last night.

__________________
If my calculations are correct, when this baby hits 88 miles per hour... you're gonna see some serious shit.
AOP AIN'T GOT SHIT ON ME!
I'M THE JUGGERNAUT, BITCH!
Quote:
Originally Posted by iniviate
Who on 72"+ tires can do better than that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by z71on46s
I will monster truck your shit!
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamsnotsoperformance
oops read that backwards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by damnyankee
I've built everything on mine and you make me want to throw rocks at it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ON TIME
SHUT THE F#CK UP CORKY!
adamsoffroadperformance

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True Bogger
Registered: 03/26/11
Posts: 614
Reply with quote  #19 

Please teach us master


__________________
the planetary trucks break pinion shafts occasionally. the 5 ton trucks don't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stevessuperduty
the true mud bogging in the good mud will always happen behind the scenes in the woods on private land.



http://www.adamsoffroadperformance.com

http://www.gearharteng.com
MUD SLUT

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HIGHLY CONTROVERSIAL
Registered: 03/24/11
Posts: 1,366
Reply with quote  #20 
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamsoffroadperformance

Please teach us master [rofl][rofl][wave]

 

Gladly, Adam. Better getcha popcorn ready...[biggrin]

 
On second thought, you might just ignore the facts, flip the heck out, and start posting videos that tell us nothing. Then, you'll attempt to drag me down at any chance you can get until the day you die, no thanks. [rofl]


__________________
If my calculations are correct, when this baby hits 88 miles per hour... you're gonna see some serious shit.
AOP AIN'T GOT SHIT ON ME!
I'M THE JUGGERNAUT, BITCH!
Quote:
Originally Posted by iniviate
Who on 72"+ tires can do better than that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by z71on46s
I will monster truck your shit!
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamsnotsoperformance
oops read that backwards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by damnyankee
I've built everything on mine and you make me want to throw rocks at it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ON TIME
SHUT THE F#CK UP CORKY!
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